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I only joined this site in October and at first I thought all of these CV accounts here were dupe accounts of one person, but now I see they are other people aping the Charlene Vesuvius account. The question is why. Some of the Charlene Vesuvius comments I've seen are perfectly good, but then there seems to be a strong emotional component to other comments of Charlene Vesuvius that I can see as the source of the angst in this forum towards Charlene Vesuvius.

So here goes: Charlene Vesuvius is perfectly welcome in the group "Public Discussion Forum". However, I want to keep a lid on the ongoing angst. So I deleted a post from yesterday entitled "Candlelight Shopping Off to Bad Start" because of the negative emotional component to it. Charlene Vesuvius is welcome to post this subject matter again, or any other subject matter she or he wants, but it must be emotionally neutral, not condescending to Beaconites as the tone and words of "Candlelight Shopping Off to Bad Start" clearly was.

I've seen Charlene Vesuvius post perfectly good subject matter/ comments before, so I wish she or he continues doing so in "Public Discussion Forum".

I also want to be completely transparent, not like I'm some weird shadowy censorship force, so every time I delete a post, I will make a note of what I've deleted and why on that person's homepage, on that person's Comment Wall. That way, anyone can see what I've done and my reason for doing it, and develop their own opinion about the effectiveness/ ineffectiveness of my moderation.

Go to Charlene Vesuvius's Comment Wall if you want to see what I deleted. Anyone who disagrees with my decision is perfectly welcome to do so. But nothing I will do will be shadowy and quiet, and everything I delete I will post on that person's Comment Wall.

In that way, everyone is welcome to see what I deleted and the reason for me doing it and develop their own independent opinion of my moderation and whether it aids this website and Beacon, or hurts this website and Beacon.

I wish to preserve the freewheeling anything goes feel of the top level "real" Public Discussion Forum Kelly had to close down, but get rid of the contentious negative interpersonal conflict that forced Kelly to close it down. Because it simply wasn't helping Beacon. I hope I succeed in this endeavour.

Again: the purpose of this group is to post anything you want. But it must not be:

1. Off topic, not having to do with Beacon or the surrounding Hudson Valley area.
2. Negative interpersonal conflict. Anything with an emotional component which is simply unnecessary to get the person's point across.

Tags: moderation, transparency

Views: 249

Replies to This Discussion

you're reacting to the wrong matter. the observation that nobody is shopping is perfectly ok. i have absolutely no problem with that comment

what I had a problem with is your attitude towards the people who live here. go to your comment wall, where i've copied your original comment: "Supporting Beacon doesn't just mean bellying up to the bar or getting your feed on at holiday parties." "I can't support this town alone." etc. comments like that. you can make your point without picking a fight with beaconites

what i wish you would do is post the discussion you originally made again, with the original point that shopping is down

my point to you is that you can do that without engaging negatively and emotionally with other people

so go ahead and post your discussion again, please, be my guest, i will not delete it. except this time, just don't pick a fight by condescending to others who actually live here

Charlene Vesuvius said:
Ben seems to think that observations about nobody shopping on the first Candlelight Shopping Thursday are negative. I guess she would be happier if I downright lied and reported that our merchants on Main Street were mobbed. No need to shop anymore and support these folks any longer. Everything was sold out.
there's absolutely no sexism or chauvinism in anything i have said whatsoever. it is disingenuous for you to say that your insults of the people who live in beacon is simply a woman being assertive. a woman or a man can be assertive a million ways without insulting anyone else

so i look forward to you reposting your discussion about the low shopping turnout in the assertive manner that is important to you. or, you can continue to smear my character, simply because i disapprove of you insulting people who actually live in beacon

Charlene Vesuvius said:
"Reacting emotionally" -- old school chauvinism that I haven't seen in years. Women who comment and who are assertive are reacting "emotionally"? Not the most enlightened comment I've seen on BCN.
cv: i give your troll a 6 out of 10. you have the proper inflammatory outrageousness and the persistence required of a good troll, however, your smear is unfortunately shallow. that is, anyone could see through your accusation:

assertive feminism is the rejection of traditional female roles as compliant and deferential to male requests. the modern woman's prerogative is to speak up and make her wishes known in a roomful of men. assertiveness by women, in a way that makes a true misogynistic pig angry, simply involves a woman speaking up and making her own feelings and desires known, when the chauvinist expects that she simply be quiet and do what he wishes

so your accusation doesn't pass even a cursory glance, since, as i have said in every post so far, and reassert now in this post as well, that i don't want you to be quiet. i want you to post as many discussions as you want in this forum

all i ask of you is that you not insult beacon residents

now i'm asking you to be intellectually honest: is this desire of mine to see you not insult people stem from chauvinism on my part? or perhaps i have some other motivation? such as the desire to not see this forum degrade into negative interpersonal conflict?

you lead in your discussion with insults to beacon residents. this moves some residents to respond with their own insults. result: degraded public forum. which, in some way, as a genuine troll, you atavistically derive some sort of psychological sustenance from the conflict and strife. that's why you hurl the leading insults in the first place: subconsciously or consciously you feed some sort of need

your posts, as they currently exist with the insults, serves some sort of psychological need of yours, they don't serve beacon. try to indulge the psychological need of yours to insult others in some other more anonymous forum, not this hyperlocal forum devoted to beacon. as you have admitted in a discussion on the old "real" public discussion forums, you don't even live here. you live in millbrook. cv: there are plenty of forums on the internet where you can engage in flinging insults in the anonymous glory you enjoy, without picking on the residents of a town you don't even live in

all i ask is that you not degrade this public forum, that you keep your posts insult free. are you able to do that? or is your psychological need to insult greater than your desire to help beacon?

so am i to expect more smears on my character from you?

or perhaps, a new discussion in this forum, on the topic of low shopping turnout, as you originally posted, but free of any insults to anyone else?

Charlene Vesuvius said:
Some boys don't believe that their comments are sexist because they haven't learned to see their behavior as others see it. You seem sincere about self-improvement. It's worth following up, perhaps not for dealing with BCN types, but in other aspects of your life. Good luck.
you've just called me a sexist. i've seen you call other people racist. you've invoked anti-semitism in the past. these charges are and were all completely groundless. its not like sexism, racism, and anti-semitism don't exist in this world, or don't exist in beacon. but when i have seen you apply these labels they were all outrageously invoked, such that the issue is not sexism, racism or anti-semitism, but the issue is why you feel the need to lob such dynamite groundless charges

additionally, many of your posts have a leading negativity about them, insulting residents of beacon in general, such as the post i have deleted that this thread was originally about

"My only intent is to continue to express my views and my observations to the community, and if someone is insulted by them -- well, lighten up because no offense intended"

so i have no right in your mind to be offended for being called a sexist? this is disingenuous of you, whether by malicious trollish design, or genuine psychological blind spot. either way, the fact remains that you do insult a lot of people here, and you will not do it in this forum. so you can either pay attention to how your words might be offensive, not post in this forum, or continue to have your posts here deleted only when they are insulting. so why don't you pay attention to your choice of words, post in this forum, and simply stop insulting people? this is not difficult for you, i've seen you post plenty of insult-free comments in the past. i do think you care about beacon, and that the original intent of your remarks actually do spring from a genuine concern for beacon, which is appreciated. i just ask that you PLEASE STOP INSULTING PEOPLE

"But if someone decides to make it personal about me, however -- a long standing habit here -- I will just slap them back because they deserve it."

yes cv, people respond to you negatively because you insult them. and then you respond to their negative feedback with further insults. repeat ad nauseum. and so the public forums are degraded into mindless interpersonal conflict, nothing to do with beacon, much like this thread has been degraded as well. which is one of the reasons kelly had to close the "real" public discussion forums. so if i am going to make these forums work where kelly's top level forum did not, i have to nip the insults in the bud, whether from you, or directed at you, or from anyone else directed at anyone else. its not about you cv, its about stopping the insults. that's my motivation here

have you ever asked why people get so personal with you? what is your hypothesis on the reason for that? do people get personal with you just because grass is green and the sky is blue? is it possible, perhaps, that you lead with outrageous accusations and negative remarks? could that be the reason?

so... drum roll please... why don't you just stop insulting people in the first place? (rimshot) why don't you simply take the care to make sure that your initial comments are without offense and insult to the residents of beacon?

either you are a committed troll, taking delight in this extensive display of grief in this thread on my dime, or you have a genuine colossal interpersonal social defect where you cannot understand why your leading negativity and outrageous incitement is the source of the conflict you often find yourself embroiled in here

either way, i don't care. because the fact remains, when i see you make leading comments with insults in them at the expense of the residents of beacon in this forum, i will delete your comment. consider this thread a closing remark on the issue. in any possible future deletes of comments/ discussions of yours, i will not comment so excessively as i have done here, i will simply refer back to this thread

because i think that if any good is done in this thread, it is that at this point it lays pretty bare for all to see the central issue at hand

for the 100th time cv, my wish is that you continue to post in this forum, and that i don't have to ever delete a comment of yours ever again. because you have stopped... insulting... people... full stop

Charlene Vesuvius said:
Ben, I couldn't care less about you or what you think. Nor do I give your "instructions" or advice any serious consideration. My only intent is to continue to express my views and my observations to the community, and if someone is insulted by them -- well, lighten up because no offense intended. But if someone decides to make it personal about me, however -- a long standing habit here -- I will just slap them back because they deserve it. That simple.
ok, let's try a new tack:

cv, i am a horribly misogynistic pig. i'm an insensitive male chauvinistic lout and my head is swimming constantly in sexist thoughts. additionally, i am anti-semitic, anti-muslim, anti-christian, and anti-atheist. i am anti-black, anti-white, and anti-asian. i am against vegetarians and against carnivores. i stand resolutely and irrationally opposed to left handed dentists. finally, i occasionally behead dandelions in my backyard while laughing demonically

now that we have established what a monster i am and started an inquest into my vast and despicable crimes against humanity, is it possible to extract a pledge from you not to insult the residents of beacon anymore?

Charlene Vesuvius said:
Just briefly. When someone calls the comments of a women too emotional -- that is a sexist comment. Check with your closest Human Resource professional. I'm really not making this up.
now you see that's a good troll. i give you a 9 out of 10. a nice restatement and repackaging of the issue here, carefully arranged with all of the leading inferences put into contexts alien to the topic at hand and deftly arranged to outrage the reader. if subconscious, you're a natural genius of anti-comic timing. if on purpose, you are a sublime artist of the art of trolling. well done madam (or sir, we don't actually know who you are or where you are after all. maybe you actually live in beacon)

"Supporting Beacon doesn't just mean bellying up to the bar or getting your feed on at holiday parties."

"I can't support this town alone."

these are pulls from your original top level discussion that was deleted

cv: you are welcome to comment in this group any time you want. but if i see leading emotionally charged comments like the ones above, i will delete your discussion/ comment (as in, emotionally charged, without any sexism implied: for someone who expects so much thick skin on behalf of the targets of your negativity you seem to be rather thin skinned, no?)

happy posting, battle scarred troll. its nice to have someone of such talent posting here. please stop using your gifts here, and find some other forum to outrage and insult. thanks

Charlene Vesuvius said:
You forgot anti-intelligence. I never insult the residents of Beacon. Most of the 14,000 residents of Beacon actually agree with my point of view and tell me on a regular basis how grateful they are that someone speaks for the majority and for hem. Now, if you personally feel insulted, which I guess you do, I'm sorry ... because it is not my intention to insult you. As I said before, I don't care about you or your feelings or your biases one iota. Insulting you is just not on the agenda.

Ben Royce said:
ok, let's try a new tack:

cv, i am a horribly misogynistic pig. i'm an insensitive male chauvinistic lout and my head is swimming constantly in sexist thoughts. additionally, i am anti-semitic, anti-muslim, anti-christian, and anti-atheist. i am anti-black, anti-white, and anti-asian. i am against vegetarians and against carnivores. i stand resolutely and irrationally opposed to left handed dentists. finally, i occasionally behead dandelions in my backyard while laughing demonically

now that we have established what a monster i am and started an inquest into my vast and despicable crimes against humanity, is it possible to extract a pledge from you not to insult the residents of beacon anymore?

Charlene Vesuvius said:
Just briefly. When someone calls the comments of a women too emotional -- that is a sexist comment. Check with your closest Human Resource professional. I'm really not making this up.
C'mon Charlene. Everyone knows you're a man.
back up a bit here - CV - can you elaborate on this statement ?

"Most of the 14,000 residents of Beacon actually agree with my point of view and tell me on a regular basis how grateful they are that someone speaks for the majority and for hem."

How have you figured out that the 14K people agree with you, and how is that they tell you how grateful they are for you on a regular basis ??
cv: its somewhat awesome the disconnect, how far you read into other people's comments. and yet at the same time, how short your perception is about the impact of your own abusive words on others. its a psychological chasm of such amazing distance its amazing how you can manage the cognitive dissonance, whether on purpose or by psychological blind spot

cv, as a gesture of good will, i would be happy to delete henry's comment for you. i really do have the full intention of deleting any insults directed your way. however cv, i mean actual insults, not flimsy comments you read FAR FAR into

cv, there was no homophobia in henry's comment. i've seen you claim racism and antisemitism in the past on the flimsiest of reasons: a scarf on the head of rosie the riveter in a political ad, a private art party scheduled on a jewish holy day. you've accused me of sexism in this thread, because i used the word emotional to describe your words. and now henry is a homophobe, simply because we don't know who you are, or where you are. you open yourself up to conjecture cv because of the outlandishness of your accusations and the persistence of your contentious statements on this website

example:

http://www.beaconcitizen.com/forum/topics/biking-in-beacon-lessons-...

As many of you know, Shelly and I are avid bicycle enthusiasts, regularly bike-commuting, weather permitting, from Millbrook to Beacon to work with my assistant and others in the community.

you claim to live in millbrook and commute regularly to beacon BY BIKE. that's 30 miles, a 45 minute drive. i have a good friend who lives in beacon who used to work at the bike shop on route 9, he used to commute to work on route 52. until that bike shop (wheel and heel) relocated to downtown wappingers falls. he tried to continue commuting by bike, but it was too hard... to wappingers falls. and he is young and in good shape. how do you do it, lance armstrong? (see, i just called you lance armstrong. this is your big chance to claim high holy righteous moral indignation about my bias against men with one testicle)

furthermore you write:

We have been thinking for a while about what Beacon could do to create a bicycle culture in our little city and recently decided to visit two of the most bike friendly cities in the world, Amsterdam and Portland, Oregon, to see if any lessons could be applied here.

LOL. so you took a fact finding mission to amsterdam and portland, just to investigate bicycle culture as applied to beacon? see, i feel like at this point i am dealing with norma desmond in sunset boulevard

because what you describe in this comment is a flight of fancy, and obviously not reality. so you open yourself up to question if any of what you project here is real. perhaps you are a 13 year old girl in kenosha wisconsin. perhaps you are a 69 year old retiree in peoria illinois. of course that's outlandish of me to speculate that about you. just as outlandish as the idea you regularly commute 30 miles one way by bike to beacon and take fact finding intercontinental flights to investigate bike culture on beacon's behalf. its just not reality cv, the fakery you project here. my suspicion is that you actually do live in beacon, that would be why you focus your griefgiving on this forum. whether man or woman, who knows, but you certainly enjoy playing an act that is obviously not real

this stuff cv, is why people here have a problem with you:

http://www.beaconcitizen.com/forum/topics/2195795:Topic:2101

I love Beacon. I'm not exactly sure why. I only come up here one or two weekends a month. I actually think that my house is not even technically in Beacon although part of my property rests somewhere in the Beacon City School District. But I do love this little city.

"up" here? so what happened to living in millbrook and commuting by bike cv? if you live in new york city, that would explain why you would choose millbrook as your supposed home: it looks close enough to beacon on google maps, huh? maybe you should try zooming in a little next time before picking your fake home. i think glenham would be the fake residence that you were looking for to fit your ruse. so what's the route you take from millbrook btw? do you do route 82 to route 52? or do you go route 44 and then down route 9? maybe you put rockets on your bike and go down the taconic, is that it cv? that depiction makes as much as sense as anything else you project about who and what you are here

and then later from the same post:

The thought that Key Food could become Fairway is not only a fantasy but offensive to the good, but very poor people of Beacon. They couldn't afford to shop there. If Key Food morphed into Balducci's, where would the people who survive on food stamps and manager's specials – that's the half-price sale of chickens with freshness dates that have just expired – go to shop? Should another supermarket open just for them? Maybe they should just take a taxi across the river

this is the heart of our problem with you cv. what that paragraph is is a well crafted troll, intended to provoke outrage. that's your intent: to piss people off and harvest the ill will, the spotlight, everyone focused on you. what the heck gives you the right to lob such outlandish depictions at beacon residents? not that they are poor (see, i have qualify everything, because you will purposely twist my words and put them in alien contexts to imply i meant something i clearly did not write), but that anyone here thinks the poor should just "take a taxi across the river". the only person in beacon who is thinking and writing such things is you cv

you're not a real person cv. your claims of racism, antisemitism, sexism, homophobia, and vaunted defender of the poor of beacon: its all feigned, a hoax. what you project here is fake, you're not a real person. you're an act intended to provoke outrage for your enjoyment. you say "I love Beacon. I'm not exactly sure why." well we know why: you love beacon the same way a wolf loves a flock of sheep: its a feeding ground for you. you have a psychological problem. you don't actually care about beacon, you care about feeding an ego which derives sustenance from negative interpersonal conflict. you're a troll. this very thread, this post, is feeding your ego: its all about you, you, you

so what's the backstory cv? why does this website and this city deserve your griefgiving? did you try to open a business and it wasn't approved? did someone in this city break your heart, and every time you pine for them from your pad in brooklyn you feel the need to lob vitriol towards beacon residents? did you get in a kerfuffle with a neighbor and the city sided with them so you decided to take it out on all of us? what's your motivation troll? what's the deal, why are you picking a fight with us?

consider yourself slain, battletroll. try a new gimmick here with a new fake account, or go griefing on some other website. the gig is up

i actually now seriously doubt the ability to redeem your particular fake account now. too much infamy and negative ill will associated with the "charlene vesuvius" alias. it will attract snickering and insults for a long time. we will try, you may continue to post, and i will delete negativity directed at you, but you might want to think about starting over again with a new nom de plume, the mileage on the "charlene vesuvius" fakery is too high now

i don't know, maybe in your next act you can be a long haul trucker on i84 who stops by beacon to flop with an ex wife you still have the hots for. or perhaps you can be a water inspector with fanciful and frightening tales of dubious water quality in hudson valley cities. or i know: you are a worker at indian point nuclear facility, a partisan defender of nuclear energy. you can take it personally and confuse the desire of area residents to close down indian point because it is old and dangerous with a desire for you to lose your job. when the negative and contentious remarks get high enough, you can threaten to release a cloud of radioactive gas! good times troll, good times

plenty of new horizons, troll. but the charlene vesuvius act is dead

Charlene Vesuvius said:
For 18 months now I've seen homophobic crap like this on BCN. It's not the first time that the "Henry" screen name, who I don't know at all, has attacked me for my gender and my sexual orientation. It's part of the hypocrisy and personal nature of a few on BCN. It's hateful, primitive and personally scary enough to me to report this kind of behavior. Ben, I know you have accused me of insulting the residents of Beacon as a group, but not someone personally. I hope that you would choose not to be complicit here and ask you publicly that you either warn this Henry character or delete his comments. My family would sleep easier.
Henry said:
C'mon Charlene. Everyone knows you're a man.
your intractability has been noted, person using the account of "charlene vesuvius". you continue with the charade undeterred. you are truly one committed troll

this obviously will not work out. after this post i am suspending you from this group. this is an extreme decision that should not be taken lightly. but this "charlene vesuvius" account is obviously an extraordinary case and i don't think in a decade there will be another like it. even if you could actually learn to post without insulting, the notoriety attached to this account is too extreme. you'd still be a target for retribution by others, simply as an afterglow of your previous behavior. it will be impossible for this account to be redeemed, you'd be continually dragged into new contentious exchanges, no matter how rapidly you turned your behavior here around. reinvention with a new account is the answer to your difficulties

cv: seriously, start a new account. reinvent yourself. and when you do, ask yourself what is more important to you: your ego? or your love for beacon? if you can post without insulting others, you will be a credit to this website and beacon. use your prodigious rhetorical gifts in the service of beacon, not pointed against the residents here. i am genuinely sorry i have to do this

but i will be on the lookout for you under the guise of new alternative aliases, if those new aliases lead us into outrage with charlene vesuvius style broad spectrum insults and ridiculous charges. its good fishing grounds, and you use good bait. but you need to stop fishing, and start acting like someone who cares more about beacon than their ego

at least this thread will serve as a transparent and public underlining of the reason your notoriety makes you incompatible with an on topic, insult free public forum. i will leave this thread open in case anyone wishes to disagree with my decision

your account is suspended here, but it can be reactivated... if the outcry over your suspension is loud enough. you can read some of those responses in your defense in this thread from a mute position if you like. after all, what did you say?

I never insult the residents of Beacon. Most of the 14,000 residents of Beacon actually agree with my point of view and tell me on a regular basis how grateful they are that someone speaks for the majority and for them.

Norma Desmond: [to newsreel camera] And I promise you I'll never desert you again because after 'Salome' we'll make another picture and another picture. You see, this is my life! It always will be! Nothing else! Just us, the cameras, and those wonderful people out there in the dark!... All right, Mr. DeMille, I'm ready for my close-up.

Charlene Vesuvius said:
It took me longer to read your reply than it takes to bike from Millbrook to Beacon. It is hard to take seriously someone who thinks the development of the High Line is a good model for Beacon to emulate. In any case, I will continue to take your comments as sexist as would most professionals. I will continue to think that Henry is homophobic, because that is how his character acts. I will continue to enjoy biking in Dutchess County. I will continue to travel a lot because it is easy for me to go most anywhere in the world even for a weekend and I hope to bring back information that might help Beacon when there is something relevant to report. The lessons from Portland and Amsterdam are good ones by the way. You should read them. And you should catch up on your history of this Board as well. My Key food references reflected your point of view but not in as boring a way. I was making fun of newcomers to town wanting to turn Key Food into Balducci's. Oh lord, where did you come from. BCN was interesting for a while, but has recently gone so downhill.
I actually LOL'd at "13 year old in kenosha wisconsin." I had the misfortune of living there for six months in 2003. Thanks, Ben, for the laugh.
Ben...I take exception to Charlene referring to me as "him". I've put up with this homophobic crap from he/she/it long enough.


Seriously Ben, you're doing a great job.

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